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	<title>Comments on: Theological Debate as a Blood Sport</title>
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	<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/</link>
	<description>A weblog about urbanism, technology, &#38; culture.</description>
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		<title>By: Theology From the Mop Closet &#124; jonathan stegall: creative tension</title>
		<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/comment-page-1/#comment-11737</link>
		<dc:creator>Theology From the Mop Closet &#124; jonathan stegall: creative tension</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Sep 2010 16:30:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/#comment-11737</guid>
		<description>[...] this kind of dialogue happen within Emergent circles. To an extent it is continuing to happen as folks here and there state that, regardless of whatever theological differences they might have with [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] this kind of dialogue happen within Emergent circles. To an extent it is continuing to happen as folks here and there state that, regardless of whatever theological differences they might have with [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Todd</title>
		<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/comment-page-1/#comment-10140</link>
		<dc:creator>Todd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 19:45:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/#comment-10140</guid>
		<description>Healthy post for us Jordon. It is always helpful for we in the AmericaWest to hear from our friends to the north. I could not agree more the partisanship present in our politics has made us unfriendly conversation partners in our theological endeavors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Healthy post for us Jordon. It is always helpful for we in the AmericaWest to hear from our friends to the north. I could not agree more the partisanship present in our politics has made us unfriendly conversation partners in our theological endeavors.</p>
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		<title>By: Jordon</title>
		<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/comment-page-1/#comment-10139</link>
		<dc:creator>Jordon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 16:19:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/#comment-10139</guid>
		<description>Hi Dan, I was on the CETA email list when Clark Pinnock was kicked out of the evangelical theological association and I remember his writing how painful it was for him to be treated like that.

I was always impressed with his grace under circumstances like that.  If anything his responses always made me more attracted to this his theological worldview than anything his opponents wrote.

Of course, him becoming more Wesleyan/Arminian helped a bit as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Dan, I was on the CETA email list when Clark Pinnock was kicked out of the evangelical theological association and I remember his writing how painful it was for him to be treated like that.</p>
<p>I was always impressed with his grace under circumstances like that.  If anything his responses always made me more attracted to this his theological worldview than anything his opponents wrote.</p>
<p>Of course, him becoming more Wesleyan/Arminian helped a bit as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Patrick Oden</title>
		<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/comment-page-1/#comment-10137</link>
		<dc:creator>Patrick Oden</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 15:50:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/#comment-10137</guid>
		<description>I agree with Jamie, great post (as was Jamie&#039;s)

Your comment about Barth, Bultmann, et al made me think a bit.  I think that&#039;s an interesting example of men with rather different theological approaches maintaining collegiality.  

I do wonder, though, if that&#039;s the best model.  Germany was already in almost total ecclesial collapse.  These were men who were not necessarily writing out of contrasting traditions, but were moving different directions during and immediately after some of the most shocking societal atrocities. They were all theological liberals who contributed to rebuilding theology, a task that has been carried on in the work of Pannenberg and Moltmann.  They were university men, forged in the context of academic collegiality.  

The emerging church, however, is not a product of either the academy or theological liberalism.  Just the opposite on both accounts.  Yet, because of the core elements it was not limited to either being a step-child of evangelicalism or a church growth tactic.  It&#039;s a movement whose elements provide common ground for many different threads, many of which are in other circles rather hardened foes.  

I don&#039;t think we&#039;ve seen collegiality among divergent theological traditions for a very long while.  Maybe going back to the Ecumenical councils of the first centuries of the church.  

In the meantime, we&#039;ve had a tradition of battle after battle.  Recently, the early 20th century battle between Libs and Fundies, the late 20th century &quot;battle of the Bible&quot; between Evangelicals and Evangelicals.  Where the academy meets the church, there are always significant lines being drawn, as pastors see the application for the theology in their preaching and ministry.  

What&#039;s going on in the emerging church is all too understandable and expected. Which makes those of us who want to make a stand in the middle, refusing to choose sides all that much more important. If we lean towards one side or another, church tradition for so long encourages us to make a supposed martyriffic stand against the enemies within.  But, church history shows exactly what you said--our image to the world of sniping, backbiting, hatred, is not the image of Christ.  

We have to make a turn from that, making a stand in the middle, even as in the present there are some being crushed and turned along both flanks. That&#039;s something our generation can contribute in ways that so many previous generations utterly failed at.  Even as Barth and the others show an example, they did not reach quite as far or across as many lines as we&#039;re being asked to do.  This is the moment,  I think, where the core of emerging proves itself as either yet another field of battle for an age-old war, or a new expression of church both in practice and thought that is not seduced by either right or left.  

That latter position is where I stand, and where I&#039;m going to fight to keep standing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Jamie, great post (as was Jamie&#8217;s)</p>
<p>Your comment about Barth, Bultmann, et al made me think a bit.  I think that&#8217;s an interesting example of men with rather different theological approaches maintaining collegiality.  </p>
<p>I do wonder, though, if that&#8217;s the best model.  Germany was already in almost total ecclesial collapse.  These were men who were not necessarily writing out of contrasting traditions, but were moving different directions during and immediately after some of the most shocking societal atrocities. They were all theological liberals who contributed to rebuilding theology, a task that has been carried on in the work of Pannenberg and Moltmann.  They were university men, forged in the context of academic collegiality.  </p>
<p>The emerging church, however, is not a product of either the academy or theological liberalism.  Just the opposite on both accounts.  Yet, because of the core elements it was not limited to either being a step-child of evangelicalism or a church growth tactic.  It&#8217;s a movement whose elements provide common ground for many different threads, many of which are in other circles rather hardened foes.  </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think we&#8217;ve seen collegiality among divergent theological traditions for a very long while.  Maybe going back to the Ecumenical councils of the first centuries of the church.  </p>
<p>In the meantime, we&#8217;ve had a tradition of battle after battle.  Recently, the early 20th century battle between Libs and Fundies, the late 20th century &#8220;battle of the Bible&#8221; between Evangelicals and Evangelicals.  Where the academy meets the church, there are always significant lines being drawn, as pastors see the application for the theology in their preaching and ministry.  </p>
<p>What&#8217;s going on in the emerging church is all too understandable and expected. Which makes those of us who want to make a stand in the middle, refusing to choose sides all that much more important. If we lean towards one side or another, church tradition for so long encourages us to make a supposed martyriffic stand against the enemies within.  But, church history shows exactly what you said&#8211;our image to the world of sniping, backbiting, hatred, is not the image of Christ.  </p>
<p>We have to make a turn from that, making a stand in the middle, even as in the present there are some being crushed and turned along both flanks. That&#8217;s something our generation can contribute in ways that so many previous generations utterly failed at.  Even as Barth and the others show an example, they did not reach quite as far or across as many lines as we&#8217;re being asked to do.  This is the moment,  I think, where the core of emerging proves itself as either yet another field of battle for an age-old war, or a new expression of church both in practice and thought that is not seduced by either right or left.  </p>
<p>That latter position is where I stand, and where I&#8217;m going to fight to keep standing.</p>
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		<title>By: dan sheffield</title>
		<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/comment-page-1/#comment-10136</link>
		<dc:creator>dan sheffield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 13:23:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/#comment-10136</guid>
		<description>J, I am reminded of the vitriol directed at Clark Pinnock over the years, mostly by his calvinist, deterministic colleagues from the earlier part of his faith journey who sought to disown him and and &#039;bar&#039; him from participation in the evangelical dialogue, when he continued to let the HS guide him into all truth -- eventually becoming more wesleyan/arminian :)  despite the deep hurt that he experience personally from these attacks, he has continued to respond in a gentle Christlike manner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>J, I am reminded of the vitriol directed at Clark Pinnock over the years, mostly by his calvinist, deterministic colleagues from the earlier part of his faith journey who sought to disown him and and &#8216;bar&#8217; him from participation in the evangelical dialogue, when he continued to let the HS guide him into all truth &#8212; eventually becoming more wesleyan/arminian <img src='http://www.jordoncooper.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   despite the deep hurt that he experience personally from these attacks, he has continued to respond in a gentle Christlike manner.</p>
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		<title>By: Jamie Arpin-Ricci</title>
		<link>http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/comment-page-1/#comment-10132</link>
		<dc:creator>Jamie Arpin-Ricci</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Feb 2010 02:34:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jordoncooper.com/2010/02/14/theological-debate-as-a-blood-sport/#comment-10132</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the kind words, Jordon.  This is a great post with excellent insight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the kind words, Jordon.  This is a great post with excellent insight.</p>
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